Nonprofit Leadership Insights from Jemima Attanasio: Community, Reflection, and Adaptability

Tasha: [00:00:00] Good morning. Can you please introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about your nonprofit origin story? Thank you, Tasha.

Jemima: I’m Jemima Atanasio.

Jemima: I am a fundraiser. I’m the senior director of development For Fordham College, Rose Hill here at Fordham University in New York City. I’ve been working in fundraising for just over 20 years, and I originally come from the UK, started my career there, but have spent most of my career here in New York City at various institutions.

Jemima: And I’ve worked in the arts, I’ve worked in higher education and also in K through 12 schools as well. So I have a broad perspective of nonprofit work and those sectors

Tasha: here in the city as well. That’s awesome. And for those who may not know what Fordham University, you know, does and everything, what’s a little bit of the back story of your organization?

Jemima: Absolutely. So Fordham University is over 175 years old founded in 1841. We’re one of the standout universities here in New York alongside Columbia, NYU but Fordham is a Catholic Jesuit [00:01:00] university. It founded in a. The 500 year tradition of Jesuit education. Very important values and you know, developing the whole person.

Jemima: Cura personalis is a big Latin phrase that basically says we holistically look at every student as a whole person all that aspects of their education. So they get fabulous degrees. We have undergraduate and graduate programs. And we have about 16, 000 students across the whole university. So it’s a big place.

Jemima: We have two campuses. So my campus that I work with most directly is in the Bronx. And then there’s a campus at Lincoln, in Lincoln Center right by right in Manhattan near Central Park. So, we also have a campus in London, a campus upstate in in Westchester and the Calder Center.

Jemima: We have lots of areas of the university, but it’s a great place to be. Lots of lots of people engage. And like I say, we’ve got over 200, 000 alumni from those 175 years. So big population.

Tasha: Yeah, that’s incredible. And what’s your favorite part of having worked in this [00:02:00] wonderful industry?

Jemima: My favorite part of working in nonprofit is collaboration, being able to share things in the space and really working together. We’ve talked about this before in some of the interviews and different conversations you and I have had Tasha. About how this is really a partnership between many different constituents in, in fundraising generally, but also in the nonprofit space.

Jemima: So donors are able to impact the institutions that we work in through their gifts, volunteers, help, and are really a very crucial part of what we do staff time, obviously staff who are very invested in the kind of work and issues at hand in each nonprofit. And so it’s a really collaborative environment where a lot of people share ideas.

Jemima: We share, you know, challenges, different things that happen, how we work together and how we can sort of work in each individual institution as well. That is my favorite part of being in the nonprofit

Tasha: space. I love it. And you gave such a brilliant example of [00:03:00] nonprofit collaboration, which I feel Many of us are a little bummed at the lack of collaboration we see within the non profit world right now, but you gave a brilliant example of in the arts community in New York City, you know, a bunch of different dance companies coming together.

Tasha: So there is collaboration. We just need to maybe push for it and look for it. That’s

Jemima: right. Yeah. I shared with you a story about how. In the early stages of COVID all of the theaters here across the arts sector in New York City had to shut down because of COVID and then in the summer of 2021, when the theaters were able to, and dance companies particularly came together, there were five or six dance companies very well reputed world reputations as different dance organizations came together and presented a week long program highlighting showcasing their work together on the same stage with the same.

Jemima: And these are very different kinds of companies. I was very fortunate to work for New York City Ballet years ago. But there are four or five Ballet [00:04:00] Hispanico, Alvin Ailey Company, American Ballet Theater who all came together and kind of put together this program. And they’ve Continue that initiative, and it’s one of those ways where each company you know, led from their leaders down, their artistic directors, their executive directors to say, how can, how are you doing it inside the company that you’re working with?

Jemima: Who are we working with? You know, sometimes donors, you know, have a natural tendency to go to one company or another or one theater or another, or one institution or another, but they’re able to share and kind of relate to each other and then help each other, I think, in that sense as well.

Tasha: That’s incredible.

Tasha: And just a great example of, those are groups that we often look at and go, well, they’re all competing for the same donors, same money. But I love, you know, when when Dan Palotta you know, the movie Uncharitable came out and part of the idea being that, you know, the pie can be grown, right?

Tasha: Like what if instead by all of those groups coming together, There’s a new love for ballet and for dance and [00:05:00] theater and all of those things brought forward because that combined social proof and star power and all of that instead inspires more people, right? To like, be involved. They’re like, I love this.

Tasha: This is something I want to I think

Jemima: also as somebody who has moved jobs and worked with different companies, what has fascinated me, obviously I’ve been fortunate. To stay in one city. But I have seen the donors. Follow me. I mean, I come to these companies and I’ll get to the database and I have just Fordham these last two years meeting with donors and, oh, I’m a subscriber at New York City ballet or I, my child went to one of the schools that I worked at or, you know, and I kept, it keeps crossing all over the place and you see people in unexpected places.

Jemima: You had no idea they were actually a supporter of this or that meant something to them too. I think that for me, yeah. It is that additional recognition that we’re very nuanced, you know, individuals, all of us, [00:06:00] we all have different stages of our lives where we do things and deep down things that are really important to us that we may not really even know how to express or So and then, but it’s by how we show up in some of these, you know, nonprofits that we support or, you know, I, yesterday we, I was sharing, we had a, an event for the Alvin Ailey dance company and our students at Fordham who are in a BFA program.

Jemima: They do a full degree. both as students at the dance company and at Fordham at the same time. And at their performance, I was sitting next to someone who worked for, who was on the board at another university. And she was sharing all, she’d never been to see our company before, but she has deep knowledge of education.

Jemima: So, you know, you get this, you know, really multi led perspective on people, which I think is fascinating as somebody who’s very interested in, you know, human, you know, human spirit, human empathy,

Tasha: that sort of thing. I think we need. Different layers of community, right? Like we’re too multifaceted to go, Oh, this is the only [00:07:00] community that can possibly serve all of my needs.

Tasha: And in fact, that’s. In some way, I had someone recently say, aren’t you concerned that if this other community hive that’s focused in on nonprofit work starts up, it will take away from your members. No, if anything, if that’s a better fit for them and they only have X amount of time, then that’s where they should be.

Tasha: If that’s what that community speaks more to them, they should be there. But just how Community is not exclusive to each other, right? Like there can be crossover different things will feed your soul at different times. And that is what community is, right? Like there’s an ebb and a flow to it that we we like to, and in fundraising, I see it frequently.

Tasha: We’d like to be, we’d like to go, this is our donor and they’ll forever be our donor. And there are now ours, but that’s not how it works. Right. Our passions are not limited to one, one thing only, right?

Jemima: Yeah. I think it’s also another thing that’s fascinating about the [00:08:00] education space. I’m a very deep believer in long term continual learning, but sort of a, both on a professional development level and like sort of lifelong learning that adults, you know, well, to the very day that we die are able to continue to learn and change.

Jemima: But being in the education space, we meet and talk to a lot of donors, a lot of parents you know, their children, you know, what children are learning from their parents, their grandparents. We have a lot of multi generational families who have attended Fordham University. So, I work with one family, their sons are the 25th and 26th members of their family to go to the university and they’ve got more coming in the next few years.

Jemima: But there’s also this sense of like what they’re learning through your organization as they’re seeing, and I’ve seen this, and it’s one of the things that I think is hardest, not a challenge in nonprofits and sort of sits alongside the fact that I’ve moved is that you build these relationships and you see people change as they, you know, discover new things or, [00:09:00] Their Children arrive at the school and suddenly an alum who has barely been engaged is suddenly, you know, at every event and is really interested in which professor is teaching and how they’re, you know, what things are going on the campus.

Jemima: It’s a really that long term relationship building is a key part of what we do. And so, you know, it’s that learning environment is just such a it’s For me, for someone, again, like me, who is really interested in that, like watching your donor change or watching a volunteer or someone else is as fascinating as, you know, getting to, to ask them for money or impact something at the university.

Jemima: It’s watching them kind of be. Changed by that as

Tasha: well. So it’s gonna, I always ask people about challenges that they’re seeing in the sector. And I think I’m going to ask you too fast it because I think there’s some unique challenges to the higher education space. That sounds like Fordham’s doing a really good job of getting around because there’s huge amounts of discussion about how to engage alumni and how to [00:10:00] continue to Cut people invested after they leave school.

Tasha: So that’s a huge challenge. And then there’s also just non profit work and the challenges of working in this sector. So I’m going to ask you both of those because I’m interested

Jemima: in

Tasha: the answer to both. Yeah.

Jemima: I think the first one I’ll address first with Fordham and sort of how we’re able to.

Jemima: You know, kind of meet some of those challenges, yes, of the industry and of generally, how do people connect with the communities that they spend time in? Fordham has this deep history, as I shared at the beginning in the Ignatian values. So the Jesuit the Jesuit origin story is around St.

Jemima: Ignatius from the 1500s. Which is an incredible, you know, perspective on our history and currently also in a moment where things are moving very fast to remember how long and deep some of these sort of ideas, these educational values and initiatives have been in deeply in, in sort of deeply set in our communities, but the Fordham community, [00:11:00] therefore is built, you know, on many levels, but has this sort of sense of we call ourselves Ramily.

Jemima: So we’re the Rams, which is the Fordham mascot, and Go Rams is our athletic chant. We’re not a huge athletic school, but we’ve got great programs. Vince Lombardi very famous football player, was a Fordham alum, and we’ve got others who have been, you know, really been Scully, who was in baseball, like a famous announcer on the West Coast for years and years.

Jemima: He’s also an alum. We have great, a great feeling around that. And the ramily matches this mascot of the ram with the family aspect. And there is something that isn’t that is Still very genuine around that. It’s not like I’ve been other places where like you’re creating a brand or you’re curating a brand or, you know, it is, but there is something very genuine about how this deep connection is about again, sort of showing up where you are, what you’re, we have students here who.

Jemima: are certainly not Catholic and really, you know, plenty who have, are nuns, you know, wouldn’t [00:12:00] tick a box in anything. But, and yet they feel very much part of this community and part of what Fordham is. And so it’s a really interesting and I think very, not unique, it happens elsewhere too, but for someone who has seen it a lot of places has that aspect.

Jemima: So I think for the challenge there. You know, it’s what do we offer that we continue to dig into that? And it’s good questions. It’s, you know, being open to change. It’s being open. It’s being flexible. It’s being adaptable and open to saying this worked five years ago, this worked before COVID, this may have worked before, you know, in a different, but it’s not the right thing for the right moment.

Jemima: So on the challenges friend, in terms of also then resources and, you know, different. Challenges for the nonprofit space. Generally, you know, relying we and I’ve seen this a lot and you know, folks talking about this on LinkedIn and relying on one stream of income is really tough. You just, you know, you’re up to you.

Jemima: You’re kind of in a place where you need to You know, just [00:13:00] focus on that. Like we have been able. We are a a university with lots of different programs, but we’re not really dug into one thing or another. We’ve got enough. You know, we’ve got enough funding, but not so much that we’re overwhelmed by. So things like the most recent federal grants that are, you know, being cut and we’re not a university fortunately that we are a university would love to have lots of grants.

Jemima: Work as well. We do have a good amount, but we’re not so reliant on that, that all of everything will go away. It’s a very tough thing in non profits, because I do believe in the bigger space that in order to, there’s this dynamic and we’re just talking about it, how we collaborate together, how we share, but then we do have to say, this is the space, like you were saying with the Hive, like if it was this space for someone, like in that, You’re not going to say we’re going to create a whole big program and expect everybody to invest in all of it.

Jemima: So, how do you balance that? It is a true challenge. And I think that [00:14:00] if you’re going to create impact at a deep level, sometimes you do need to say, You know, for example, at my university, is it, do we have to have a medical program and engineering and this and that on top of everything else, or what are the things that we do really best and how can we add an additive to the space rather than, so it’s a complicated picture but it’s definitely, you know, a challenge to, you know, kind of invest in that picture as well.

Tasha: We had recently when Evan and I had an interview with Ariel Glassman for good nonsense, one of the things she had said is, you know, nonprofits diversifying doesn’t mean spreading yourself thin. That’s not what it is. If there’s a space that. It’s working really well. And you’ve got like two or three pillars double down on the two that are working the best, right?

Tasha: Make them deeper. And what does it look like to go deeper on that pillar? Is it more engagement with donors? Is it, you know, better relationships with funders? Is it actually getting more stories from your constituents?

Who knows

Tasha: [00:15:00] what that looks like, but maybe doubling down on that pillar that’s working really well versus going, we need more pillars.

Tasha: That’s not necessarily the right way to go. And I do think, you know, there’s always going to be a portion of the people you communicate with as a nonprofit. That will never move out of audience mode. They’ll have, they’re happy there. You can’t actually force them to be part of you. They don’t want to be right.

Tasha: Right. They’re happy getting their email newsletter and they donate once a year. And that’s enough for them. It’s those other people who actually want more and deeply want to be engaged. How do you find a way to satisfy those people? And how do you find a way to like, if they want deeper, what does it look like to go deeper?

Tasha: And I think that’s a real challenge for us resource strap team. Yes. Manage. They’re very distinctly different

Jemima: yeah, definitely. And I mean, I think it goes across the board, like however big you are. I mean, I think that In the corporate space, we see this, you know, you see it very frequently. You have a big company that, you [00:16:00] know, decides they’re going to buy something else and they’re going to do everything.

Jemima: Now they’re going to be the supply chain and they’re going to be the provide, you know, the storefront and they’re gonna be all these different things and they realize that it’s not. you know, you can’t run, you shouldn’t run everything either, but like, it’s actually very hard to do that. At Fordham, for example, we, with the Jesuit values we have, we’re very strong in the in ethics and social justice and just sort of the sense of like, what is the right, you know, and deeply in philosophy, like all our students take core classes in philosophy, it’s ancient Greek philosophy, it’s modern philosophy, you know, it’s across the board.

Jemima: Yeah. So there’s a deep knowledge of like how what are some of those reasonings and being open to listening to other reasons and so on so that is something that we have taught for 175 plus years here at Fordham. Well, you know, how do we map that onto AI and technology? How do we map that onto what we’re seeing in the medical space or what we might be seeing?

Jemima: And what does that mean? [00:17:00] And how do we as a university then say, this is the level of expertise additive that we are able to, and you do a joint degree or you sit in both, you know, we have really strong natural sciences here, biology, physics, and chemistry. And our undergrads go on to great med programs elsewhere.

Jemima: How do we, how does that humanities focus at the undergraduate level with philosophy. They take some theology, you know, when they’re in a history class, an English class, like what does that add to the fact that they’re going to be a doctor or a nurse or a, you know, in front of a patient five or 10 years from now when they can understand, they can actually verbally express things to students, to, to patients, sorry, rather than, you know, it’s really and take some of those ethical questions and, you know, we all see those things in space.

Jemima: So how do we do that? In a better way too. And I think that, you know, nonprofits, the resources thing is like, well, how long is it going to take to invest in that? And how many people really, and who’s got the bandwidth for that? [00:18:00] And the questioning one of the biggest One of the most important and powerful things that I have dug into here at Fordham is reflection, the power of standing back and saying, this is how I did it last week, this is how I did it last month, this is how I did it last year, or this is how we did it in those ways, and what did work and what didn’t work, and how can we, you know, what does that mean?

Jemima: Do we need to do it a different way? Do we need to try it? Do we need to put that aside? There’s a term indifference which is, It’s sort of a deeper kind of philosophical thought around it. Like how do we step back where it doesn’t kind of like, of course it matters, but how do we kind of let it sit so that we can let it go if we need to?

Jemima: And I think a lot of nonprofits are so powerfully and passionately in this space,

Tasha: letting

Jemima: go of things is really hard. So it’s something that comes across very vividly to me sitting in this space because I’ve been in a lot of. non profits and particularly fundraising where you hold so tight [00:19:00] to what you’re doing.

Jemima: You’re really desperate for the money or desperate for the, you know, for the things to work. And there’s a sense that I’ve been able to kind of take a pause from some of that’s been really helpful.

Tasha: I feel like there’s like 10 conversations in the last, like, three sentences is fantastic.

Tasha: What have you gotten so far? You’ve been a member of the nonprofit hive kind of since the beginning.

Tasha: I know. Yeah. You’ve been in a net of chats, you’ve been super supportive on LinkedIn of everything we’ve been doing, which, you know, my heart loves so much, so deeply. What have you gotten out of being a member of this community? Thank you.

Jemima: Yeah, I, so I want to do more of the one on one chats. I’ve only My schedule.

Jemima: So I’ll tell you, first of all, I love the fact that you always have them on Thursdays right now or that it’s very consistent so that we can sign up and you can really be on top of that. For me, Thursdays are just not a great day for me to jump in on things. So like I’ve missed quite a lot of, you know, kind of opportunities to do that.

Jemima: But I am a LinkedIn person. I love to share my hashtag [00:20:00] on LinkedIn is more to share more to gain. And I do believe that like, Again, that collaborative space, sharing giving back is partially just letting other people read and be exposed to this, the different perspectives and different ideas.

Jemima: I love to put out anything that you guys, that the Nonprofit Hive puts together. Some of the interviews are fabulous. Your blogs, posts. So full of deep reflective content as well, and I think that’s a really great space. The third thing is just the people, you know, I’ve met, I always go through.

Jemima: I’m a big commenter on LinkedIn. I see who else has liked your posts. I check them out. Am I connected? Am I not? I, you know, send some invitations. So to get connected to them on LinkedIn as well. And I really do believe that you know, we are. better when we’re together like that and when we’re hearing from each other.

Jemima: I do, the last thing I love about The Hive is the fact that it’s such an international network. And I’ve seen so many people in the space who have come to you [00:21:00] and come to The Hive as an opportunity space. I was really fortunate 10 years ago. I was working for my alma mater, Oxford University, and we used to host a gathering, a couple of gatherings in our offices and at other offices in New York City for professionals from Europe and nonprofit professionals or development fundraisers from Europe and from Africa in the sense of kind of how do we do things in New York?

Jemima: They would take them on visit for a couple of days. It was sponsored by the King Badwin Foundation in Belgium. And we would talk to them, you know, in a series of kind of, you know, like a little bit like a lunch and learn, but they would come for two or three days. They’d visit different nonprofits and the way again, totally different.

Jemima: I haven’t grown up in the UK. Nonprofit space looks different. Like we’re sort of behind in some of those things. But then when you talk to, you know, folks who are working in charities and in Africa was just a whole, I mean, they basically, they barely have, you know, I mean, let alone a spreadsheet, you know, they don’t have bank accounts and they didn’t have.

Jemima: Cell phones and you know, so it was like, how do you get the information [00:22:00] to your donors? How do you find community? And it was in that I think has been such a wonderful part of watching The folks who’ve really joined and are really a part of what you’re doing Tasha. So I appreciate

Tasha: that a lot I totally agree.

Tasha: I had no idea it would go international so quickly and nor did I know that I would have very close friends Across Africa, but I frequently are cheer, not only cheering me on, but I get a chance to cheer them on. Like it’s such a special special group of humans. I totally agree. So how can people follow up with you, Jemima?

Tasha: Obviously, you know, I love that you’re checking in and connecting with people off of LinkedIn posts. That makes me so thrilled, but how can people, what’s the best way for them to reach you? Definitely through

Jemima: LinkedIn. It’s the space that I use to, to connect with people. If you’re in New York City, let me know.

Jemima: I love to get a cup of coffee or you know, share a walk. I’m a big walker at lunchtime. It’s one of the things I try and do to get out and about. So if anyone’s local and wants to message me on LinkedIn, let me know they’re here. I’m always happy to meet in person too, [00:23:00] but yeah, I. Post on LinkedIn try and share under my hashtag which of the other one is fundraising in the wild, which is sharing the nature and the photography and the music and where the fundraising kind of connects with that.

Jemima: So, yeah, those are the places to find me. That was amazing. Thank

Tasha: you so much for doing this with me. It’s such a pleasure. Thank you, Tasha. Lovely to be here.